JD on EP

This is not a cliche, more of a recent issue. I've read that AS3 has options to read and write to clipboard content. I see potnetial security issue when reading the clipboard and potenntial spamming usage... byu v1agra c1a11is, etc.

To be honest - this has just hit the blogs and is spreading ;)

Also think about intrusive publicity, with Flash. After it's like anti pop-up software but versus Flash.
It's clearly because of the content creator and Adobe can't do much against, but it's the cliche I heard most.

Ahmet

As per several of the points you have already made these are down to the developer but affiliated to the product:
- Skip Intro
- Slow load times
- "In your face, distracting whizzy stuff"
- Annoying Banner Ads
- Music/SFX takeover

All old news but still brought up by the less informed

Aside from security issues, everything listed tends to not be a limitation of Flash but a reflection of the extent to which the Flash programmer is willing to go. Flash is only a tool and only does what the programmer's instructions state. It's the same as any other type of web programming - crappy development yields crappy work.

In regards to searching, if you use swfObject or UFO to render your flash content to the screen, search engines will index whatever was your alternate content in the DIV which gets over-written with the flash content.

There is a good article on "progressive enhancement" on devnet.

Your site can potentially be as searchable as an HTML site... (and it fixes that horrible IE/Eolas plug-in patent work around too)

Hi John,

really nice post! Some times ago I talk about Flash Usability at the german Macromedia Studio 8 Tour. After that I build a site, which try to disprove all (most of all) of the Flash Usability problems.

Site: http://www.orange-project.com
Maybe the entry "Orange-Project - The Technical View" of my Blog is interessting for you: http://blog.jensfranke.com/2006/02/11/orange-project-%e2%80%93-the-technical-view/

Best
Jens

Sorry, here the correct link: Orange Project - The Technical View

Text fields can be set to allow copy / paste functions matching HTML abilities, links may be offered for images. Tiny unreadable pixel fonts are a present and looming problem as screen resolutions increase as are layouts that fail to scale, resulting in postage stamp size presentations on large vacant screens.

Saving a web page with Flash elements when using Internet Explorer fails... though there is an unpublished workaround. This makes Flash navigation elements taboo for corporate pages one might need for offline or long term reference. Other browsers save Flash elements, why no published method for 90% of the market?

Shared objects are not deleted when the browser cache is cleared which will eventually lead to privacy objections.

Flash 8 and above does not support Windows 9x. I think in the cheatsheet, Audience size section, this should be mentioned, i.e. what percentage of users this affects. I don't think many left using the OSes, still I have no figures, and some figures may help.

Best regards,
Burak

Standards?
Well you are obviouslyt one of those who don't wanna be reached :D
http://www.thinkvitamin.com/features/design/why-standards-still-matter

(Cosmin, I had read that article earlier this weekend, and it made me think back to when the "web standards" campaign started, and I kept asking "Which standards do you mean? Why are you using GIF instead of PNG then? Must we use VRML?" but my earnest questions were studiously ignored. Seemed like a People Of The Book campaign. That ThinkVitamin treatise this week didn't get down to base issues either.)

Top 5 reasons I am looking forward to WPF/E, not FP 10. :)

1) WPF/E doesn't require an expensive enterprise license like Flex
2) WPF/E will support the same programming model as all my other projects
3) WPF/E will support the same languages as all my other projects
4) WPF/E will use WMV, which I can get free encoders and SDKs for, instead of having to license a new expensive and proprietary codec every 2 years.
5) At the file format level, Flash's drawing support sucks. I can't even select a dotted line style or line cap style.

:)

Jesse Ezell, you've got good points for being able to use languages and technology you know, but let me counter a couple of things so that people don't get confused.

Flex doesn't *require* an expensive license in all cases. The component framework is free, and there's even a free version of Flex Data Services. It's pretty useful when you only need a single CPU server. However, I'm assuming that you're looking for a solution for a much larger enterprise system. I don't have any numbers on hand, but I imagine that a large Microsoft enterprise solution is still a pretty decent chunk of change.

For your comments on drawing support, it's true that you can't draw dotted lines through code (without rolling your own solution), but designers can choose line styles in the IDE. Hopefully Actionscript support will improve in the future. As an example, Flash 8 added many features that were previously only possible for designers. You're completely wrong about line cap styles. These were added in Flash 8, and they may be changed in the IDE and in Actionscript.

@Filmy,
Not sure where you got that info, but it's wrong.

Here's the relevant documentation (bottom of page):
http://livedocs.macromedia.com/flex/2/langref/flash/system/System.html#setClipboard()

I believe JavaScript can also "setClipboard()"

The anti-Flash objection that I still hold, and that I continue to hear from other former devotees, is the violation of trust that occurred when Macromedia presented the Yahoo toolbar with the Flash player as an opt-out, rather than opt-in, download choice. The mistrust this fostered wasn't helped by MM staffers' excruciatingly delicate tergiversation about why this was not "bundling."

That alarming incident has become a trend, now that the Google Toolbar is being bundled -- yes, bundled, in so many words, this time -- with the Shockwave player.

Josh,

I said "enterprise license" for a reason. I was talking about enterprise deployments. I am well aware that you can use Flex for free in certain special cases. As far as costs compared to MS in this area, you don't have any additional costs for using .NET or ATLAS on your server no matter what the scale is, and it's probably safe to assume that WPF/E will be the same.

When I talk about line caps, I am not talking about round vs. flat caps. I am talking about things like arrow heads that even plain old Win32 GDI has supported forever.

[jd sez: Sorta off-topic to the main point... we're looking at top anti-SWF cliches and their corresponding support info.]

1:
"This is more a rant about microsoft's IE." The active x problem is still a problme yet flash has made it the first priourty browser to work for yet the same time linux still has no fully working up to date plugin for firefox under linux. I diss like that flash has been working more for a browser that has been controversial in the way that it manages it's secrity problems at the same time putting firefox on the back burners, a fastly growing proven better technology.

[jd sez: Wait, let me read that again.... ;-) ]

2: 64bit? why's it look more like flash is looking to make more proprietary technology that ignores the new trends in standers for performance, I just hope that adobe plans to adress this newwer form of processing power with flash 9 seeing as meny OS's have been made available for some time under the 64bit cpu making it that much more incapable for with that technology and as well not utilizing the performance for enduser and or the IDE for flash.

[jd sez: Hmm, I think I get it... this comment is actually about 64-bit Linux, right? There's no MSIE on Linux, that's what tipped me. Both Macromedia and Adobe have delivered Linux runtimes for longer than you might be aware of, and the Flash difference this cycle is (a) fast evolution between FP8 and FP9, and the decision to go straight to FP9 rather than keep it behind; and (b) the video sites which your friends tell you about chose to use the tighter codec in FP8. 64-bit native doesn't seem like it will happen this version, although the 64-bit browsers now can use 32-bit bridge wrappers. Videos comin' your way, towards the turn of this year. But this is still 'way, 'way off-topic to the original subject of a quick summary of the top objections to using the SWF filetype, and their rebuttals!!]

This is a good idea JD. Maybe your rebuttals can be presented in two columns (advantages/disadvantages) where you accept some of negatives about Flash. I think a few of your rebuttals sound a tad easier than the reality. For example, yes you can make an accessible Flash site as well as one that's find-able via search engines--but it's a ton of work... arguably more than alternatives.

Perhaps the best idea is to just clearly demonstrate where Flash excells. With all due respect many examples and demonstration sites showcased on Adobe aren't that great. Wait, I'm being nice... some of them suck! Point to real sites out there (which you often do)--those are convincing. (By the way, what's up with SOME of the recent SODs? They seem really marginal.)

If a client brings up one of these objections it doesn't matter if they're whacked and I can prove they're whacked... they're not going to use Flash. The clients who know where Flash can provide a value will use it--and even if some of these (real) objections have to be deferred. If I hear an objection I'll just move on--I love arguing but what's the point in that case? "No, no mr. big client, Flash isn't really proprietary."

Anyway, I'll add some of the stuff I hear out here in the wild:
--no control (to remove the "about" thingy ) from right click (unless, I suspect, if you can pay a price).
--font wrapping/layout containers (yeah, I know about Flex).
...plus one of my recent ones: bugs getting injected when Adobe "upgrades" the player. For example, I have an existing site that was effectively rendered buggy when Flash 9 introduced the issue with ExternalInterface on Firefox. I don't know if there's even a workaround (I don't think so)--but that doesn't matter... I don't have time to go back and fix that site right now. Meanwhile my client isn't exactly happy. Over the years it's been SUPER rare that a new player breaks old content... but here's a case and from this end it's hard to accept. I hope it's not a sign of things to come.

Sorry to end so negatively... I'm just pointing out the stuff that I think can improve. By the nature of this post, I'm not pointing out all the awesome stuff that's working just fine--thanks!

Not a cliche, but a fact of life. ;)

No support for bi-directional text or right-to-left languages.

You know the real problem with Flash?

The way it empowers people with no creative skill or judgment to come up with ways to eat my time by littering 'entertaining' crap around the net.

How about a fast-forward button?

How about mandatory licensing for all Flash content developers with a body of randomly-selected peers queried once per month to determine whether said developer retains license?

Then any individual caught developing Flash content without a license would be subject to anonymous beatdowns from concerned citizens.

[jd sez: May I see your text-writing license please, miss...?]

All of my sites are all flash. Some with browser navigation. My clients love them!

Biggest cliches I hear about the Flash Player are:

- Not possible to select and copy text
- Not possible to resize text using the mouse wheel
- Not possible to save pictures

Another cliches is:
Not possible to use the backward/forward browser buttons...

Possible since Flash 7 if I remember right.

When Users complain about the constant, distracting animated ads that cannot be disabled, I just suggest taping a piece of cardboard on the monitor. That way, they don't have to look at the offending ad. I also direct them to download free software that allows them to turn off FLASH or (at least) stop it from looping after the first play. But, many users uninstall FLASH and just deal with the blank object boxes. Too bad the new version of FLASH doesn't give users more of a choice. DJ

Thease all things are possible
1.select and copy text
2.save pictures (with help of server side script)even u can save ur own run time drawing.
3.use the backward/forward browser
4.setClipboard (this is working)..
etc.
I found most of the complaints are possible in flash actionscript 2.0.